Looking back over the last few months I've chosen to take 3 running shots at foxes, they were running, not me !
Nothing was taken at over 65-70 yards, all dropped to the shot and all had a known safe backstop.
2 were with a .243 and one with a .22LR..
It's not always the done thing in this country, on the Continent it's widely accepted
Do you take running shots or do you choose, not.
H
To shoot or Not to shoot - That is the Question ?
To shoot or Not to shoot - That is the Question ?
...is this a pistol in my hand, or am I just pleased to see you ?
Re: To shoot or Not to shoot - That is the Question ?
The only time i have ever done it was with an old remington nylon .22lr at rabbits ,as i knew it never jammed and it would shoot as fast as i could pull the trigger so if i needed a second shot it would be virtually instant (which i needed to do on one occasion) its not something i do regularly but if i needed to i would be happy to do it againHartshot wrote:Looking back over the last few months I've chosen to take 3 running shots at foxes, they were running, not me !
Nothing was taken at over 65-70 yards, all dropped to the shot and all had a known safe backstop.
2 were with a .243 and one with a .22LR..
It's not always the done thing in this country, on the Continent it's widely accepted
Do you take running shots or do you choose, not.
H
Re: To shoot or Not to shoot - That is the Question ?
.22lr? tbh i dont think i'd take a shot at a RUNNING fox, if it was just moving steadily and i was confidant of the shot then maybe
C.F? yes many times, used to be standard practice with the lamp
C.F? yes many times, used to be standard practice with the lamp
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Fox Hunter
- Posts: 1036
- Joined: 15 Oct 2011, 18:20
- Location: Wales
Re: To shoot or Not to shoot - That is the Question ?
Only if I know that's the only chance I'm going to get. If theres a good possibility it could go further and glance back I try and resist the moving shot. I remember one about 15 yrs ago popped up in front of me and run weirdly up the field, shot it up the arris and found it only had 3 legs. One seemed like it had previously been shot off but had healed perfectly. Always found platting of bipod legs were a problem with side to side runners but since buying an atlas bipod it makes life so much easier tracking them.
Re: To shoot or Not to shoot - That is the Question ?
I never take shots at anything running. If you do not get it. Its another educated Fox that gets away that bit wiser. If you start feeling comfortable doing it with Foxes. Would you do the same for a Deer that is toddling along. I do not see the difference in any of the two of them. Meaning it is ok to do it with Foxes but not for Deer.
Thats my personnel choice. I have seen many shots that were fired at stationary Foxes and Deer that have been really bad shots, that have required. Me to administer the fatal shot to put them out of their misery.
Everything to do with shooting comes down to confidence. If you have shot 35 Foxes in a row without a miss, you are pretty confident number 36 is adding to the tally. If you miss, it can instil doubt, which results in some time at a target to see if it was the rifle at fault or your self.
I have been to many Fox drives over the years. I only ever shot running foxes with my Beretta semi auto. With 3" mags.
Each to their own. If you are comfortable doing it. Power to you.
Ian
Thats my personnel choice. I have seen many shots that were fired at stationary Foxes and Deer that have been really bad shots, that have required. Me to administer the fatal shot to put them out of their misery.
Everything to do with shooting comes down to confidence. If you have shot 35 Foxes in a row without a miss, you are pretty confident number 36 is adding to the tally. If you miss, it can instil doubt, which results in some time at a target to see if it was the rifle at fault or your self.
I have been to many Fox drives over the years. I only ever shot running foxes with my Beretta semi auto. With 3" mags.
Each to their own. If you are comfortable doing it. Power to you.
Ian
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Fox Hunter
- Posts: 1036
- Joined: 15 Oct 2011, 18:20
- Location: Wales
Re: To shoot or Not to shoot - That is the Question ?
A sensible reply but..SikaStag wrote:I never take shots at anything running. If you do not get it. Its another educated Fox that gets away that bit wiser. If you start feeling comfortable doing it with Foxes. Would you do the same for a Deer that is toddling along. I do not see the difference in any of the two of them. Meaning it is ok to do it with Foxes but not for Deer.
Thats my personnel choice. I have seen many shots that were fired at stationary Foxes and Deer that have been really bad shots, that have required. Me to administer the fatal shot to put them out of their misery.
Everything to do with shooting comes down to confidence. If you have shot 35 Foxes in a row without a miss, you are pretty confident number 36 is adding to the tally. If you miss, it can instil doubt, which results in some time at a target to see if it was the rifle at fault or your self.
I have been to many Fox drives over the years. I only ever shot running foxes with my Beretta semi auto. With 3" mags.
Each to their own. If you are comfortable doing it. Power to you.
Ian
A deer doesn't kill lambs etc and if that's my only chance to take the fox then so be it. Unbelievably I've actually missed them when they've been standing still(foxes that is), I must be a really shit shot
Re: To shoot or Not to shoot - That is the Question ?
A sensible reply but..
A deer doesn't kill lambs etc and if that's my only chance to take the fox then so be it. Unbelievably I've actually missed them when they've been standing still(foxes that is), I must be a really shit shot[/quote]
I live on a Sheep Farm, 2000 odd acres with 800 ewes and 200 hogs kept every year to replenish the stock. replace old ones that die. I still do not shoot Foxes running. Reason being. They are running for a reason. They have had someone shoot at them before either running or sitting. We are talking educated foxes that run. I tend to not have many educated Foxes running around. Their education ended abruptly, before it began. The Foxes here squeak into you, not run away from you.
As I said what you do works for you. I am not criticising any one for how they conduct their self whist out shooting.
I did have a laugh at one of night hunters videos. Where he shot at the Fox on the move. Missed completely. Then blamed the Fox for the miss, for not standing still.
Deer do not kill lambs, you are correct. Mention Deer to a hill Farmer and he thinks that a Deer eats the same grass as 3 sheep do on the hill. he see's them as much a threat to his livelihood as Mr Fox.
Still wouldn't shoot one running (I know no one has mentioned shooting Deer running, I aint accusing anyone of doing that).
Ian
A deer doesn't kill lambs etc and if that's my only chance to take the fox then so be it. Unbelievably I've actually missed them when they've been standing still(foxes that is), I must be a really shit shot
[/quote]I live on a Sheep Farm, 2000 odd acres with 800 ewes and 200 hogs kept every year to replenish the stock. replace old ones that die. I still do not shoot Foxes running. Reason being. They are running for a reason. They have had someone shoot at them before either running or sitting. We are talking educated foxes that run. I tend to not have many educated Foxes running around. Their education ended abruptly, before it began. The Foxes here squeak into you, not run away from you.
As I said what you do works for you. I am not criticising any one for how they conduct their self whist out shooting.
I did have a laugh at one of night hunters videos. Where he shot at the Fox on the move. Missed completely. Then blamed the Fox for the miss, for not standing still.
Deer do not kill lambs, you are correct. Mention Deer to a hill Farmer and he thinks that a Deer eats the same grass as 3 sheep do on the hill. he see's them as much a threat to his livelihood as Mr Fox.
Still wouldn't shoot one running (I know no one has mentioned shooting Deer running, I aint accusing anyone of doing that).
Ian
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Fox Hunter
- Posts: 1036
- Joined: 15 Oct 2011, 18:20
- Location: Wales
Re: To shoot or Not to shoot - That is the Question ?
[quote="SikaStag"]A sensible reply but..
A deer doesn't kill lambs etc and if that's my only chance to take the fox then so be it. Unbelievably I've actually missed them when they've been standing still(foxes that is), I must be a really shit shot[/quote]
I live on a Sheep Farm, 2000 odd acres with 800 ewes and 200 hogs kept every year to replenish the stock. replace old ones that die. I still do not shoot Foxes running. Reason being. They are running for a reason. They have had someone shoot at them before either running or sitting. We are talking educated foxes that run. I tend to not have many educated Foxes running around. Their education ended abruptly, before it began. The Foxes here squeak into you, not run away from you.
As I said what you do works for you. I am not criticising any one for how they conduct their self whist out shooting.
I did have a laugh at one of night hunters videos. Where he shot at the Fox on the move. Missed completely. Then blamed the Fox for the miss, for not standing still.
Deer do not kill lambs, you are correct. Mention Deer to a hill Farmer and he thinks that a Deer eats the same grass as 3 sheep do on the hill. he see's them as much a threat to his livelihood as Mr Fox.
Still wouldn't shoot one running (I know no one has mentioned shooting Deer running, I aint accusing anyone of doing that).
Ian[/quote]
Again a well balanced reply, literacy is where I fall way short but...
Like you I live on a hill sheep farm with a fair number of stock, out of interest can I ask if you own the farm and stock or just live there?
My problem is although no one else has any permission here we are surrounded by 'idiots'. These are the ones that create the lamp shy foxes, not just shooting and missing or injuring but trying to run dogs in areas where its 'impossible' to catch foxes. As you say squeaking puts the shits up a lot of foxes here at certain times because they've heard it so many times. On several occasions I've found myself slapping 'educated' friends who are about to purse their lips to shut them up and just wait for the shot to present itself instead.
I agree about the deer eating the grass, not had any experience of them here but rabbits were doing enough damage to cause me to wipe them out 20yrs ago. I've now got two areas where I 'manage' them just to have a little sport and a feed in the summer. The rabbits attracted 'others' which was more of a problem than the grass but in recent years there's been a lot less educated foxes. Even though I use nv I still use a lamp and I only take the shot if I'm confident I'm going to hit it whether its still or on the move.
As for deer, I'm guessing bullet placement is far more critical than with fox so I definitely wouldn't condone shooting those on the move.
A deer doesn't kill lambs etc and if that's my only chance to take the fox then so be it. Unbelievably I've actually missed them when they've been standing still(foxes that is), I must be a really shit shot
[/quote]I live on a Sheep Farm, 2000 odd acres with 800 ewes and 200 hogs kept every year to replenish the stock. replace old ones that die. I still do not shoot Foxes running. Reason being. They are running for a reason. They have had someone shoot at them before either running or sitting. We are talking educated foxes that run. I tend to not have many educated Foxes running around. Their education ended abruptly, before it began. The Foxes here squeak into you, not run away from you.
As I said what you do works for you. I am not criticising any one for how they conduct their self whist out shooting.
I did have a laugh at one of night hunters videos. Where he shot at the Fox on the move. Missed completely. Then blamed the Fox for the miss, for not standing still.
Deer do not kill lambs, you are correct. Mention Deer to a hill Farmer and he thinks that a Deer eats the same grass as 3 sheep do on the hill. he see's them as much a threat to his livelihood as Mr Fox.
Still wouldn't shoot one running (I know no one has mentioned shooting Deer running, I aint accusing anyone of doing that).
Ian[/quote]
Again a well balanced reply, literacy is where I fall way short but...
Like you I live on a hill sheep farm with a fair number of stock, out of interest can I ask if you own the farm and stock or just live there?
My problem is although no one else has any permission here we are surrounded by 'idiots'. These are the ones that create the lamp shy foxes, not just shooting and missing or injuring but trying to run dogs in areas where its 'impossible' to catch foxes. As you say squeaking puts the shits up a lot of foxes here at certain times because they've heard it so many times. On several occasions I've found myself slapping 'educated' friends who are about to purse their lips to shut them up and just wait for the shot to present itself instead.
I agree about the deer eating the grass, not had any experience of them here but rabbits were doing enough damage to cause me to wipe them out 20yrs ago. I've now got two areas where I 'manage' them just to have a little sport and a feed in the summer. The rabbits attracted 'others' which was more of a problem than the grass but in recent years there's been a lot less educated foxes. Even though I use nv I still use a lamp and I only take the shot if I'm confident I'm going to hit it whether its still or on the move.
As for deer, I'm guessing bullet placement is far more critical than with fox so I definitely wouldn't condone shooting those on the move.
Re: To shoot or Not to shoot - That is the Question ?
I do not own the Farm. I moved here seven years ago. Renting the Farm house and all the outbuildings apart from the main big Green shed that is used for working the sheep.
I lived here for three months, when the Farmer asked me to do some work for him, it went from doing that work to me having a sheep dog and looking after the Sheep. The Farmer and his two sons and I would work together gathering and working with the sheep. I had a good thing going.
The Farm had been in their Family for 117 years. I thought they would never sell it. As we hear people say. Nothing lasts forever. The youngest son didn't like sheep that much, he was more into cattle and arable ground. He was bought a new farm on good land, The Farm here was sold to the next door neighbour. They own more than half a dozen farms, with workers on each Farm. I was welcome to work my arse off but was not getting paid for it. No thank you. Get on with it. The owner asked me the other day, How is your lambing coming on. I told him I do not have any sheep to lamb. They want you to work for free. Part of the deal to keep my rent the same price,was that I continue as I had always done to feed the sheep in the winter. I have an 8 wheel drive Scottrack machine that I use to pick dead sheep up on the Farm. they supply me with my fuel.
I would go back to how it was before in a minute. My sheep dog is coming up on 4 years old. I bought her as a pup and started her off myself, her training was progressing nicely. She was working on the Farm. Then they told me they were selling and it put a stop to her getting the work she needed to keep her going forward in her training. I had bought another pup and was bringing that on too. I sold her to a herd that was going to bring her on himself. I miss working with the sheep. Was a good living.
Ian
I lived here for three months, when the Farmer asked me to do some work for him, it went from doing that work to me having a sheep dog and looking after the Sheep. The Farmer and his two sons and I would work together gathering and working with the sheep. I had a good thing going.
The Farm had been in their Family for 117 years. I thought they would never sell it. As we hear people say. Nothing lasts forever. The youngest son didn't like sheep that much, he was more into cattle and arable ground. He was bought a new farm on good land, The Farm here was sold to the next door neighbour. They own more than half a dozen farms, with workers on each Farm. I was welcome to work my arse off but was not getting paid for it. No thank you. Get on with it. The owner asked me the other day, How is your lambing coming on. I told him I do not have any sheep to lamb. They want you to work for free. Part of the deal to keep my rent the same price,was that I continue as I had always done to feed the sheep in the winter. I have an 8 wheel drive Scottrack machine that I use to pick dead sheep up on the Farm. they supply me with my fuel.
I would go back to how it was before in a minute. My sheep dog is coming up on 4 years old. I bought her as a pup and started her off myself, her training was progressing nicely. She was working on the Farm. Then they told me they were selling and it put a stop to her getting the work she needed to keep her going forward in her training. I had bought another pup and was bringing that on too. I sold her to a herd that was going to bring her on himself. I miss working with the sheep. Was a good living.
Ian
Re: To shoot or Not to shoot - That is the Question ?
As you pointed out Ian, deer are a totally different story.
I agree with you, running shots on them are not recommended. For a start they are considerably tougher than a fox, it can be hard enough dropping them when standing still, let alone legging it !
The 3 shots on fox I opted to take :
1, Shot at 25-30 yards (.243) - surprise meeting followed by a staring competition from 20 yards on the edge of a large field, the vixen ran out into the open field to head across it. Dropped with the shot going through the last ribs near side and coming out behind the opposite shoulder
2, Shot at 35-40 yards (.243) - Similar to the first but without the staring competition. Shot a little further forward than fox #1 and same side
3, Shot at 65-70 yards (.22LR 10-22 semi auto) - Another chance meeting, in daytime. I was on the opposite side of a waterway, fence on the other side and water between us with a narrow strip of land for Charlie to run down. The fox had nowhere to go except across me for over 100 yards. Dropped to the first shot but followed up anyway when his tail flicked. It was the mangey old dog fox in my Mangey Fox thread
H
I agree with you, running shots on them are not recommended. For a start they are considerably tougher than a fox, it can be hard enough dropping them when standing still, let alone legging it !
The 3 shots on fox I opted to take :
1, Shot at 25-30 yards (.243) - surprise meeting followed by a staring competition from 20 yards on the edge of a large field, the vixen ran out into the open field to head across it. Dropped with the shot going through the last ribs near side and coming out behind the opposite shoulder
2, Shot at 35-40 yards (.243) - Similar to the first but without the staring competition. Shot a little further forward than fox #1 and same side
3, Shot at 65-70 yards (.22LR 10-22 semi auto) - Another chance meeting, in daytime. I was on the opposite side of a waterway, fence on the other side and water between us with a narrow strip of land for Charlie to run down. The fox had nowhere to go except across me for over 100 yards. Dropped to the first shot but followed up anyway when his tail flicked. It was the mangey old dog fox in my Mangey Fox thread
H
...is this a pistol in my hand, or am I just pleased to see you ?